I am of the opinion that every weapon should be viable in some way on One Down. The more weapon options there are, the more min-max skill options there are, and that allows for even more diverse crew setups, which makes for a game with variety in choice. Variety in choice means a game that doesn't get stale quickly (remember crossbow meta?). The enemies already hit like freight trains and never stop spawning during a wave, basically requiring Inspire builds with Nine Lives aced. Why should your options to overcome this hurdle as a player be incredibly limited as well?
To be fair, the skill for piercing body armor is still useful for every other applicable class of weapon. It simply states: "Your ranged weapons can now pierce body armor". If any weapon class should be able to do this by default, it's LMGs. SMGs, assault rifles, pistols, shotguns, etc. all still benefit from this skill. There are also plenty of instances where a weapon or ammo type pierces body armor by default making the skill obsolete in those cases too.
Shield damage reduction is currently not working as intended. I need to find (or be informed of) the correct command for it because the goal was that it would take about 10 - 15 bullets in order to spray down a single shield. Wall and object penetration makes absolute sense from my POV since you have to know where an enemy is to make the most use of it or you are just wasting bullets. However the only weapon class it makes sense to be able to do this with is again, LMGs.
Assault rifles have more mod options than LMGs by far. Some can become DMRs, some can be used with Low Blow + Berzerker + Body Expertise, some can hit 100 Accuracy and 100 Stability, and one DMR has a grenade launcher attached to it, effectively making it two weapons in one slot. Several of them match the damage of my re-balanced Buzzsaw (approx. 55 damage with silencer skills) with similar or higher rates of fire than the RPK, with good ammo pickup rates, all while having considerably less horizontal recoil to deal with while laying down sustained fire. They are capable of dealing with bulldozers at longer ranges much easier. They are not made obsolete by this mod in the slightest.
It's your opinion that LMGs shouldn't have the ability to land shots at all at long ranges, but we have the Far Away skill in the shotgun tree that allows for the absurd ability to land shots well outside any known shotgun's effective range, allowing you to take on snipers or pick off bulldozers in the distance with ease. Can you really say LMGs shouldn't be allowed to land these type of long range shots with careful controlled fire, but it's perfectly fine for shotguns, pistols, and SMGs that don't even require controlled bursts? With that said, I am taking a look at reducing the accuracy bonuses just a tad (4 - 8 points).
When it comes to damage, all of the LMGs are similar in how many Deathwish and One Down specials they can kill per second, and this is offset by the various advantages each LMG has over the others. If the enemies are so clustered together that the enemy piercing feature comes into play, their damage output is increased considerably, which is part of what makes them worth bringing into jobs as the small damage boost alone wouldn't be enough to stop from being overwhelmed on a strong CPU host.
For example, if we are using Silent Killer, Berzerker @ 1.8x damage, and Body Expertise aced:
The Brenner-21 and RPK are both capable of killing two 1800 HP specials per second with their fire rates, and have the lowest horizontal recoil among the LMGs, making them the easiest to control without using the bipod, which translates into decently higher damage output over the other LMGs when not using the bipod due to less missed shots. They also manage to achieve the highest stability and accuracy combo among the LMGs AND have the capability to tactical reload. When using Lock n' Load and Bloodthirst Aced together, you can reload their large magazines in less than 2 seconds, eliminating the need to fall back very far before getting back into position to hold a point, but having both of these skills is not necessary to have a decently fast reload time.
The Buzzsaw 42 is capable of killing three 1800 HP specials per second due to its fire rate, the highest of the LMGs despite having the lowest damage stat potential with weapon mods among them. It also has the highest ammo pickup by default of the LMGs, but cannot tactical reload, making reload skills fairly necessary to prevent over 5 seconds of downtime while reloading. The strong horizontal recoil means you must use the bipod more often, especially to take on bulldozers at anything outside of very close range despite being able to reach 100 Stability with weapon mods.
The KSP 58 and KSP sit firmly in the middle. They have the strong horizontal recoil the Buzzsaw 42 has forcing more bipod use, are capable of killing just under three 1800 HP specials per second with their fire rates, their ammo pickup sits between the RPK/Brenner and Buzzsaw, they are not capable of the same combined accuracy and stability of the RPK/Brenner, and cannot tactical reload, again, making reload skills fairly necessary to prevent over 5 seconds of downtime while reloading.
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@Alcat101
I am of the opinion that every weapon should be viable in some way on One Down. The more weapon options there are, the more min-max skill options there are, and that allows for even more diverse crew setups, which makes for a game with variety in choice. Variety in choice means a game that doesn't get stale quickly (remember crossbow meta?). The enemies already hit like freight trains and never stop spawning during a wave, basically requiring Inspire builds with Nine Lives aced. Why should your options to overcome this hurdle as a player be incredibly limited as well?
To be fair, the skill for piercing body armor is still useful for every other applicable class of weapon. It simply states: "Your ranged weapons can now pierce body armor". If any weapon class should be able to do this by default, it's LMGs. SMGs, assault rifles, pistols, shotguns, etc. all still benefit from this skill. There are also plenty of instances where a weapon or ammo type pierces body armor by default making the skill obsolete in those cases too.
Shield damage reduction is currently not working as intended. I need to find (or be informed of) the correct command for it because the goal was that it would take about 10 - 15 bullets in order to spray down a single shield. Wall and object penetration makes absolute sense from my POV since you have to know where an enemy is to make the most use of it or you are just wasting bullets. However the only weapon class it makes sense to be able to do this with is again, LMGs.
Assault rifles have more mod options than LMGs by far. Some can become DMRs, some can be used with Low Blow + Berzerker + Body Expertise, some can hit 100 Accuracy and 100 Stability, and one DMR has a grenade launcher attached to it, effectively making it two weapons in one slot. Several of them match the damage of my re-balanced Buzzsaw (approx. 55 damage with silencer skills) with similar or higher rates of fire than the RPK, with good ammo pickup rates, all while having considerably less horizontal recoil to deal with while laying down sustained fire. They are capable of dealing with bulldozers at longer ranges much easier. They are not made obsolete by this mod in the slightest.
It's your opinion that LMGs shouldn't have the ability to land shots at all at long ranges, but we have the Far Away skill in the shotgun tree that allows for the absurd ability to land shots well outside any known shotgun's effective range, allowing you to take on snipers or pick off bulldozers in the distance with ease. Can you really say LMGs shouldn't be allowed to land these type of long range shots with careful controlled fire, but it's perfectly fine for shotguns, pistols, and SMGs that don't even require controlled bursts? With that said, I am taking a look at reducing the accuracy bonuses just a tad (4 - 8 points).
@I Am Nuggets
When it comes to damage, all of the LMGs are similar in how many Deathwish and One Down specials they can kill per second, and this is offset by the various advantages each LMG has over the others. If the enemies are so clustered together that the enemy piercing feature comes into play, their damage output is increased considerably, which is part of what makes them worth bringing into jobs as the small damage boost alone wouldn't be enough to stop from being overwhelmed on a strong CPU host.
For example, if we are using Silent Killer, Berzerker @ 1.8x damage, and Body Expertise aced:
The Brenner-21 and RPK are both capable of killing two 1800 HP specials per second with their fire rates, and have the lowest horizontal recoil among the LMGs, making them the easiest to control without using the bipod, which translates into decently higher damage output over the other LMGs when not using the bipod due to less missed shots. They also manage to achieve the highest stability and accuracy combo among the LMGs AND have the capability to tactical reload. When using Lock n' Load and Bloodthirst Aced together, you can reload their large magazines in less than 2 seconds, eliminating the need to fall back very far before getting back into position to hold a point, but having both of these skills is not necessary to have a decently fast reload time.
The Buzzsaw 42 is capable of killing three 1800 HP specials per second due to its fire rate, the highest of the LMGs despite having the lowest damage stat potential with weapon mods among them. It also has the highest ammo pickup by default of the LMGs, but cannot tactical reload, making reload skills fairly necessary to prevent over 5 seconds of downtime while reloading. The strong horizontal recoil means you must use the bipod more often, especially to take on bulldozers at anything outside of very close range despite being able to reach 100 Stability with weapon mods.
The KSP 58 and KSP sit firmly in the middle. They have the strong horizontal recoil the Buzzsaw 42 has forcing more bipod use, are capable of killing just under three 1800 HP specials per second with their fire rates, their ammo pickup sits between the RPK/Brenner and Buzzsaw, they are not capable of the same combined accuracy and stability of the RPK/Brenner, and cannot tactical reload, again, making reload skills fairly necessary to prevent over 5 seconds of downtime while reloading.